James Trimm <jstrimm@h...>
Date: Sat Jul 1, 2000 9:40am
Subject: For the Record
All,
One more time for the record I would like to clear up some of the
misinformation posted by [Mrs. H.]
First of all it needs to be said that [Mrs. H] is supposed to be
banned from posting on any SANJ lists but she has resubscribed under a new
e-mail address. She knows that she is not permitted to use our lists and
is in violation of the law in using them. [Mrs. H.] and her husband are
the
only two people in the world to ever be disaccomidated formally by the
International Nazarene Beit Din.
This being said let me now clarify:
1. [Mrs. H.] posted a message titled "James Trimm rejects Yeshua" (I think
that was the title) that is totally false. I totally accept Yeshua as
the Messiah of Judaism.
2. [Mrs.H.] later posted that I deny the blood atonement of Messiah.
Yet
the SANJ statement of faith as well as my book SEMITIC LIGHT ON
HEBREWS speak of this blood atonement in detail.
3. [Mrs. H.] then says that I advocate the Book of Mormon. I do
NOT. In
fact I find a number of problems in the Book of Mormon which do NOT line
up with Torah (which I have posted).
So for the record:
I have NOT rejected Yeshua as Messiah.
I have NOT rejected the blood atonement.
I do NOT advocate Mormonism or the Book of Mormon.
James Trimm
Study Torah with SANJ Mitvah Club
http://www.nazarene.net/MitzvahClub.htm
This list provided by SANJ sponsors: http://www.nazarene.net
SANJ is a non-profit organization
Message 39774 of 39867
Egroups.com/messages/bom
James Trimm 12-7-99
From James Trimm jstrimm@h... Mon Dec 6 23:11:15 1999
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Subject: [bom-messianic] Rebuttal to Anti-Missionaries
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Everyone,
The Society for the Advancement of Nazarene Judaism has produced a
response to the anti-missionaries:
LET'S GET TRUTHFUL
A 14 tape set response to Rabbi Tovia Singer's anti-missionary
tape set "Let's Get Biblical" from Outreach Judaism.
Even if you have never heard Rabbi Singer's "anti-missionary" tape set
you
will still benefit greatly from Dr. James Trimm's response to the
"anti-missionaries." This detailed response to the anti-missionaries is
a
must for:
Nazarene Jews
Messianic Jews
Hebrew Christians
Gentile Christians
"Anti-missionary" Jews
and Apologists of all kinds!
Although OUTREACH JUDAISM charges $99.00 for its "Let's Get Biblical"
tape set, we at SANJ are asking only for a $60.00 donation for the "Let's Get
Truthful" tape set.
To receive this tape set and companion study guide please send your
donation of $60.00 or more plus $5.00 shipping and handling to:
SANJ
Box 471
Hurst, TX 76053
USA
Please make your check payable to: "The Society for the Advancement of
Nazarene Judaism."
Tape Set includes:
TAPE ONE: INTRODUCTION - Learn how the anti-missionaries mislead
their audience. Learn how they do not apply the same rules to themselves
as
they apply to their opposition. Learn the four levels of understanding
of any
scripture.
TAPE TWO: THE TWO MESSIAH THEORY - Learn how anciently Judaism
maintained a belief in two Messiah's: a suffering servant and a Davidic leader.
Learn how the Qumran community believed in two coming Messiahs. Learn
how ancient Jewish scholars questioned whether these would be two Messiahs
or two comings of one Messiah.
TAPE THREE: DO MESSIANICS TWIST THE TANAK? - Does Mt. 2:15
really take Hosea 11:1b out of context? Have Messianic believers changed
Psalm 22? Does Mt. 2:23 just invent a Messianic prophecy from nowhere?
Does Mt. 1:23 misuse Is. 7:14 regarding a virgin birth? This tape answers
all
these questions.
TAPE FOUR: SIN AND ATONEMENT, - James discusses the logistics of
atonement. What does the scripture really mean "Avram believed YHWH and
it was counted to him as righteousness" (Gen. 15:6). What did Avram believe?
What does EMUNA (translated believe) mean in Hebrew? Who did Avram
believe in and how was this counted to him as righteousness? Learn the
answers to these questions and more.
TAPE FIVE: ISAIAH 53 PART 1 - Go line by line through Isaiah 52:7-53:12.
Who is speaking? Do these passages speak of Israel? Do they speak
of
Messiah? Learn the answers.
TAPE SIX: ISAIAH 53 PART 2 - Learn what ancient Rabbinic literature
taught about Is. 52:7-53:12. What does the Targum say? What does
the
Talmud say? What does the Zohar say? Learn the answers.
TAPE SEVEN: ISAIAH 53 PART 3 - Learn what the Qumran community
thought about the figure of Is. 52:7-53:12 before Yeshua was even born.
TAPE EIGHT: THE DEITY OF MESSIAH PART 1 - Learn the truth about
the deity issue.
TAPE NINE: THE DEITY OF MESSIAH PART 2
TAPE TEN: ISAIAH 9:5-6; ZECH. 12:10 & ZECH. 13:6 - Have Bible
translators altered Is. 9:5-6? Have Messianics misused Zech. 12:10 &
13:6?
Find out.
TAPE ELEVEN: DANIEL 9 - Does Daniel nine foretell the date of the coming
of Messiah? What does the Talmud say? What do the Dead Sea Scrolls
say?
Find out.
TAPE TWELVE: PSALM 2:12 and PSALM 110 Does Psalm 2:12 say
"kiss
the son"? Does Ps. 110 speak of the Messiah? What does the Targum say
about Ps. 110? What do the Dead Sea Scrolls say about Ps. 110? Has Ps.
110
been changed? Who changed it, when and why? Find out.
TAPE THIRTEEN: IN DEFENSE OF THE KETUVIM NETZARIM - Is the
New Testament really full of mistakes and contradictions? Do these writings
meet the same standards as those of the Tanak? Find out.
TAPE FOURTEEN: THE CASE FOR YESHUA AS THE MESSIAH - Learn
why it is clear from the prophecies that Yehua is the Messiah.
James Trimm
==============================================
He who seeks will not cease until he finds,
and having found he will be amazed,
and having been amazed he will reign,
and having reigned he will rest.
- The Goodnews according to the Hebrews
==============================================
The Society for the Advancement of Nazarene Judaism:
PO Box 471; Hurst, TX 76053; USA
http://www.nazarene.net
A nonprofit organization supported by freewill offerings
Check out our e-mail discusion groups.
==============================================
Nazarene IRC Chatroom
Port No: 6667 Server: nazarene.net
Channel: #SANJ
Yosef benYehudah 11-5-99
From "Yosef benYehudah" rabbiyosef@h... Fri Nov 5 10:17:19 1999
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From: "Yosef benYehudah" rabbiyosef@h...
To: bom-messianic@makelist.com
Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 09:42:36 PST
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Subject: [bom-messianic] Yosef and website
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>What happened to http://www.itstessie.com/jewishbom "The Jewishness of
the
>Book of Mormon" website???
>
>Where is Rabbi Yosef???
>
>Inquiring minds want to know!!!
The website went down because the very nice LDS woman who had run it for
over a year felt she could no longer support in light on the
coming Jewish Book of Mormon. As a concervative LDS she had strong
reservations about changing ANYTHING even Jesus to Yeshua.
At some point in the future it may go back up at another location and
another name. I will let everyone know when it does.
It will be named in such a way to draw more attention to the Jewishness of
the BoM and less attention to me.
I will answer the other questions that have come up later.
For now shalom good friends.
Yosef
______________________________________________________
Message 144 of 310
Yosef Liahona 11-16-99
From "Yosef Liahona" yosef613@h... Tue Nov 16 10:40:54 1999
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From: "Yosef Liahona" yosef613@h...
To: bom-messianic@makelist.com
Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 18:42:08 GMT
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Subject: [bom-messianic] Hillel's Rules
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All,
Please give me a few days. I am working on a small project to find examples
of the seven rules of Hillel (and maybe the 13 rules of Ishmael) in the BoM.
I am starting by locating all of the quotations and citations from the Tanak
in the BoM. (you would be surprised how many there are).
I also hope to show one example of each of the PRDS levels.
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
Replies
Author
Date
217
Re: Hillel's Rules
Ann Mullen
Tue Nov 16, 1999 8:51pm
Message 215 of 310
Egroups.com/messages/m-kabbalah
James Trimm 12-22-99
From James Trimm jstrimm@h... Wed Dec 22 00:10:18 1999
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Subject: [m-kabbalah] New Kabbalah Book
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All,
There is a new Kabbalah book coming from Avi ben Mordechai:
Messiah Volume 3
Understanding His True Identity
Through the Soul of the Torah
What exactly does this mean? "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word
was with God, and the Word was God." (Yochanan 1:1)
It is written in Colossians 1:15, "He is the image of the invisible God,
the first-born of all creation....What exactly does this mean?
In Yochanan 6:56, we read, "He who eats My flesh and drinks My blood
abides
in Me, and I in him." What did Y=92shua mean by saying these words?
In Hebrews 1:1-2, we learn the following: "God, after He spoke long ago to
the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, in these
last days has spoken to us in His Son....What exactly is all this referring
to?
What did Y=92shua mean by saying, "You must be born-again"?
Why did Rav Sha=92ul (Paul) refer to Y=92shua as the "Last Adam"?
What was the "third heaven" referred to by Rav Sha=92ul (Paul) in 2
Corinthians 12:1-3? Where is this "Third Heaven?"
Ever heard that curious phrase, "I=92m in Seventh Heaven"? Are there really
seven heavens?
It is written in Yochanan 20:22, "And when He had said this, He breathed on
them, and said to them, =91Receive the Holy Spirit.=92"What is going on
here=
?
Is this associated with Acts Chapter 2?
Who is "G-d"? Who is YHVH?=97The Name that appears over 6,800 times in
the Tanakh!
Is there any validity to the doctrine of the Trinity?
Who was the "Angel of the L-rd" that appeared to Abraham, Moses, Joshua
and countless others throughout Jewish history?
What is Gnosticism? What is Kabbalah?
What did the Hebrew prophet Yechezk=92el (Ezekiel) in Chapter One, see in
hi=s vision of the "wheels within wheels"?
What did the Hebrew writer Dani=92el in Chapter 7, see in his vision of the
"Son of Man" and the Ancient of Days?
Where did Moshe (Moses) and the Elders of Israel go when they ascended
Mount Sinai in Shemot (Exodus) Chapter 24:10? What exactly did they see?
Who was Y=92shua HaMashiach? Was He "Deity"? Was He Divinity? Is there
a difference between these two terms? How does one reconcile these things in
talking to Jewish people about Y=92shua?
Answers to these questions and MUCH MORE will be included in this new
volume from Avi ben Mordechai.
Cost of the book will be $24.00 U.S. dollars which includes shipping in
the Continental U.S.A. Between now and the release date of Messiah Volume
3 (expected for March 2000), you can receive a 90-minute audio cassette
tape study overview of the book. After the release date of Messiah Volume
3, the audio cassette tape offer will cost an additional $10.00 dollars.
The special 90-minute audio cassette tape offer applies only to prepaid
orders only of Messiah Volume 3. Send a check or money order today to:
Millennium 7000 Communications
Box 700
Kila, MT 59920
Specify that you are pre-paying for the new book and would also like
the audio cassette tape.
Message 957 of 1071
Yosef benYehudah 10-15-99
From "Yosef benYehudah" rabbiyosef@h... Fri Oct 15 21:46:56
1999
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From: "Yosef benYehudah" rabbiyosef@h...
To: m-kabbalah@makelist.com
Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 21:30:09 PDT
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Subject: [m-kabbalah] BoM Archaeology list
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Shalom all,
PLEASE FORWARD TO ALL RELATED LISTS
New list:
Book of Mormon Archaeology list.
This list will discuss:
* Book of Mormon Archaeology
* Book of Mormon Geography
* Book of Mormon Linguistics
To subscribe just send an email to:
BOM-Archaeology-subscribe@makelist.com
______________________________________________________
Message 949 of 1071
egroups.com/messages/bom-archaeology
James Trimm 4-14-2000
From jstrimm@h... Fri Apr 14 19:27:20 2000
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Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:27:09 -0500 (CDT)
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Subject: Re: [bom-archaeology] Rabbi Yosef removed from LDS list
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From: James Trimm jstrimm@h...
personally I had not posted in DAYS at the time I was ousted.
James Trimm
>In a message dated 04/14/2000 10:18:16 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
>Shemaemet@a... writes:
>
>> Not at all so. IMO - it's worse to be ousted for speaking torah and
>> midrashing on an RLDS list. In fact, it is war and it is shameful.
~
>> shabbat
>> shalom! : )
>
>
>Your desired chats were not in line with the pupose of the list. You were
>asked very politely numerous times to keep to the list design, yet when
you
>were asked, you acted like a victim. When you would not contain your
comments
>to the purpose that list was designed for, then you were removed. Very
simple
>reasons, and very valid ones. To now suddenly dredge that up here requires
>that I speak up and explain to others what happened so they do not think you
>were the injured party.
>
>Kathy
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>You can win $1000!
>Just one of 1000 great reasons to visit eGroups!
>Click here:
>http://click.egroups.com/1/2865/2/_/11406/_/955765383/
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Replies
Author
Date
625
Re: Rabbi Yosef removed from LDS list
Jason Roberts
Fri Apr 14, 2000 9:52pm
Message 622 of 755
Yosef benYehudah 11-9-99
From "Yosef benYehudah" rabbiyosef@h... Tue Nov 9
00:48:18 1999
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From: "Yosef benYehudah" rabbiyosef@h...
To: bom-archaeology@makelist.com
Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 00:51:34 PST
Mime-Version: 1.0
Subject: [bom-archaeology] Defensive Earthworks
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DOes anyone know anything about defensive earthworks found
around central american ruins which fit the descriptions in the Book of
Mormon?
______________________________________________________
Replies
Author
Date
228
Re: Defensive Earthworks
Randy Lee
Tue Nov 9, 1999 5:20am
229
Re: Defensive Earthworks
EarlyRR@a...
Tue Nov 9, 1999 8:48am
230
Re: Defensive Earthworks
ROY SCHMIDT
Tue Nov 9, 1999 9:21am
231
Re: Defensive Earthworks
Gaylord Shaw
Tue Nov 9, 1999 9:56am
Message 227 of 755
Egroups Chofjclist
James Trimm 12-4-99
James Trimm <jstrimm@h...>
Date: Sat Dec 4, 1999 4:52pm
Subject: Re: Lamsa Aramaic Trans. -The Needle and the Rope
>In a message dated 12/04/1999 12:57:59 PM Central Standard Time,
>jrgriffith@j... writes:
>
><< Subj: Fw: [chofjclist] Re: James Trimm New
Testament Aramaic Trans.
> Date: 12/04/1999 12:57:59 PM Central Standard Time
> From: jrgriffith@j...
> To: earlyrr@a...
>
> <>
> >>
> Matthew 19:24) And again I say unto you,
> It is easier for a camel to go through the eye
> of a needle, than for a rich man to enter the
> kingdom of God.
>
> (Mark 10:24) It is easier for a camel to go through
> the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into
> the kingdom of God.
>
> (Luke 18:25) For it is easier for a camel to go through
> a needle's eye, than for a rich man to enter into the
> kingdom of God.
>
> From "Gospel Light" by George Lamsa, pg. 117.
>
> "The Aramaic word 'gamla' means camel, a large rope,
> and a beam. The meaning of the word is determined
> by its content. If the word riding or burden occurs
> then 'gamla' means a camel, but when the eye of a
> needle is mentioned gamla more correctly means
> a rope. There is no connection anywhere in Aramaic
> speech or literature between camel and needle, but
> there is a definite connection between rope and needle.
> Eastern women when purchasing thread often say, "It
> is a rope, I cannot use it", which means it is too thick.
> Then again, there are ropes in every Eastern home, used
> to tie up burdens on the backs of men and of animals.
> When not used, the rope is hung on the wall or laid in
> a corner of the house.
>
> "The discussion about the rich man probably took place
> in the house. Jesus pointed to the rope in the house to
> illustrate what he was saying in condemning the greed
> of Eastern rich men, who had acquired their wealth
> unjustly. He said, "It is easier for a rope to go through the
> eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter into the
> kingdom of God." Then again there are different kinds
> of needles in use in the East; tiny needles for fine
> embroidery, the common needle for sewing which is
> larger, and the big needle about five or seven inches
> long which working men ofter carry fastened to their
> garments or attached to the rope. A good sized cord
> could easily be passed through this needle, which is
> used chiefly for sewing large bags, rugs, and tents
> woven of goat's hair.
>
> "Biblical students have suggested that when Jesus
> referred to 'needle eye' he meant the little gate in the
> wall. As there is no such gate in any oriental city called
> 'needle eye' where camels could pass through, this
> interpretation is incorrect. Some of the ancient walled
> cities in the east still remain the same as in the ancient
> days. They have several large entrances at various
> parts of the wall known as gates. Men, camels, and all
> animals enter and leave through them. They are the
> only possible place a camel could enter. The gospel
> says nothing of such a gate and plainly refers to the
> eye of a needle.
>
Yes I will discuss this one tonight
> "The word 'gamla' is also used in Matthew 23:24, but
> here it means camel because Jesus was talking about
> 'baka', gnat, and contrasting it with camel........"
>
> There are many interesting things in these books
> on Hebrew idioms and sayings.
>
> In Christ,
> Mirl
>
>
>
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Message 2476 of 3852
Yosef benYehudah 10-26-99
From "Yosef benYehudah" rabbiyosef@h... Tue Oct 26 13:14:55 1999
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From: "Yosef benYehudah" rabbiyosef@h...
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Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 13:18:09 PDT
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Subject: [chofjclist] more on 4Ne. 1:12
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The traditional understanding of 4Ne. 1:12 is based on the idea
that the author is intending to contrast the "law of Moses" with
"the commandments which they received from their Lord and their God"
However 3Ne. 15:5 states clearly "I [Messiah] am he that gave the law"
so no such contrast can be made.
Moreover the text of 4Ne. 1:12 does not indicate that the Nephites quit
doing one thing to start doing another. The text makes clear that that
is
NOT what it is saying with the beginning of the next phrase "...CONTINUING
in fasting and prayer and meeting together... (etc.)"
A careful reading of 4Ne. 1:12 in context of 3Ne. 15:5 is that the Law of
Moses and the commandments given by the Lord are not being contrasted
but
rather that the Nephites did not just keep the Law of Moses but they also
kept ALL of the other commandments given by the Lord as well. An entire
body of halachah delivered by the Lord to augment the Torah of Moses.
The
point of 4Ne. 1:12 when read carefully is that the Nephites CONTINUED to
do something, not that they quit doing one thing to do another instead.s
Rabbi Yosef
*****************************************************
* The Jews do understand the things of the prophets,*
* and there is none other people that understand the*
* things which were spoken unto the Jews like unto *
* them, save it be that they are taught after the *
* manner of the things of the Jews. (2Ne. 25:5b) *
*****************************************************
Jewishness of the Book of Mormon Website:
http://www.itstessie.com/jewishbom
-----------------------------------------
Listservers: Jewishness of the Book of Mormon;
Mormon Kabbalah & Book of Mormon Linguistics.
http://www.itstessie.com/jewishbom
Message 2304 of 3852
Yosef Liahona 12-4-99
From "Yosef Liahona" yosef613@h... Sat Dec 4 16:12:33 1999
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From: "Yosef Liahona" yosef613@h...
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Subject: [chofjclist] Where's the restoration?
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Shalom All,
From MORMON DOCTRINE by Bruce McConkie:
CHRISTMAS.
See APOSTASY,... EASTER,...
Modern day Christians celebrate December 25th
as an annual church festival and as the traditional
day of our Lord's mortal birth.... both Christmas itself
and the whole yuletide season often take on an air
of commercialism and worldliness... but the saints
nevertheless join in....
EASTER
See... CHRISTMAS...
Easter is the church festival celebrated by Christians
in commemoration of the resurrection of our Lord.
The lone scriptural reference to it (Acts 12:4) should
have been translated Passover from the Greek Pascha
found in the original. The name Easter comes from the
Norse goddess Eastre whose festival was observed at
the vernal equinox. ... Obviously, Easter... has come into
being as a compromise between pagan and apostate Christian
views,... Nonetheless the true saints gladly take it...
OK I can see the Apostsy... but where is the "restoration"?
Would someone please point out the "Restoration" group which does not
"gladly take" and "join in" what is admittedly "a compromise between pagan
and apostate Christian views"?
______________________________________________________
Replies
Author
Date
2481
Re: Where's the restoration?
EarlyRR@a...
Sat Dec 4, 1999 7:29pm
2484
Re: Where's the restoration?
Gnauman@a...
Sat Dec 4, 1999 9:21pm
2485
Re: Where's the restoration?
Gnauman@a...
Sat Dec 4, 1999 9:29pm
Message 2478 of 3852